How to win at DB v1.8 (long semi-rant)

Surge · Post by **Surge** » 22-07-2003 05:11

How to win at Deathball v1.8:

Step 1:

Take all 5 players on your team and put them in at the edges of your Pbox. 4 players, 1 on each side, 2 sharing the front portion, and a keeper.

Step 2:

After stopping ANY shot they can possibly throw at you (which is remarkabley easy) use the keeper and 1 defender to boost the other 3 players up field. This might take some practice. One all 3 offensive players are at 1/2 pass the ball up to one of them and move the last defender to the depest man on offense.

Step 3:

Run a 3 v 3 offense against defense. Use a double block to lead the way for the ball carrier and you'll almost always get a 1/2 decend shot at the net. Score, rinse and repeat. If in the process 1 player is killed have the other 2 offensive player get them selvs intentionall killed to respawn them on defense.

Why this is so effective:

On defense turtling within the Pbox allows for you to block shots, deflect shots, kill the ball carrier, kill the other attackers, and make the shooter miss or give the ball up. From the front (closest line) to the net at a 95-98% charge the ball will reach the net and score at ~.5 seconds. From the sides, its slightly longer at ~.54 seconds.

Due to turtling any no player can get to the front line and shoot a good shot without a blocker or 2 BUT because of this they would have to bring 4 people upfiled (meaning no defenders) to penetrate the turtle successfully. This sounds fair, but considering the hammer range against an enemy currently, from the edge of the pbox, the ball will take an extra .2 seconds to reach the net at least.

This .52 second shot is pefect will fall EXACTLY under the keeperer hammer delay and make it VERY difficult to stop if its a well placed shot. BUT! Because of deflect, shake, overcharge, 1 hit kills and the guelingly long charge time, these shots are near impossible to pull off (especilly since 2 players guard the front of the Pbox). If the keeper can catch the shot (if it even gets on the net) good, if not, they simply spam it away towards center field and wait for another wave of attackers.

After doing this for 1-2 waves the waves get broken up and the attack becomes a 2v4. If the defense gets the ball in the time they can EASY boost upfield createing a 3v2 situation, with control of the ball. The 2 attackers left can boost back and make a 3v3 but they're already playing catch-up. Eventually doing these 3v2 rushs will catch the attackers off guard and create 3v1's and sometimes the occasion 2-3 man break away. If they dont do it right, who cares? get gibbed, respawn on D and wait.

Eventually due to this chip away system the game either becomes an absolute boingly lengthy game with scores in the very low digits, if any at all or a complete blowout for the team that uses this method. Any attack used against the 5 man tutle is useless except the 2-3 man lead which is basically doing the same system, but allowing the defenders to have 1 defender pick and still usually come out on top resulting in a goalhanger.

The only thing that sets teams apart that use this tactic are their keepers and their 1 defender. The keeper that catchs more (opposed to volleying away) will create more offensive oppertunities. The 1 defender is what prevents the goal hanger situation. The team with the better keeper and better defender will win 100% of the time or tie if they have a bad offense, because due to the chip away system they will EVENTUALLY have an odd man rush and will likely score.

What makes this tactic possible:

- The size and shortened delay of the keeper hammer
- The ability to stack the Pbox with you entire team
- The "instant-offense" that can be created in 2 hammer shots
- The convienience of respawning on defense.
- The shot speed/pbox size/hammer delay ratios.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

I remember when DB was fun. When i would jump on a server, play for about 15-20 mins, and just have fun, not caring whether i won or lost. When pub games were actually enjoyable because it wasnt competative at all.

Simply put, in DB now, everything too easy is too effective. Plain and simple. Pbox camping is incredibly easy. You could teach your 5 year old brother to sit in the white lines and blast people when he hears them charge. Untill this is changed DB will never be fun because playing offense isnt any fun unless you either are playing againts people that dont know what they're doing, or
playing an a game where everyones playing offense and the scores get very high (like volley only games).

Since when was DB all about goalhangers and box campers? theres a lot more to the pitch thats being completely ignored other that "you use this to get upfield". You go on offense where the pbox campers are you get killed and go back to defense where the goal hangers are. You just experienced all DB has to offer. Good job.

Unless DB is changed for the better to balance out the skill differential between defending and attacking, i'm sure many people will agree with most of my speel. Deathball is getting way too competitive for no apparent reason. Even PUG games and scrims shouldnt be this competitive. We're not playing for money or prizes or world-wide recognition. We're playing because we want to. I personally dont want to be frustrated, i dont want to be pissed of by a game thats suppost to be fun.

I'm sure you've heard the proverb "you can lead a horse to water but you cant make him drink", this applys very much with deathball. We have the game, we play the game, you just arnt making us play it a certain way and your continuing to restrict the certain ways we do find. Dribble, the boost trick... Finding advantages over others by playing more and develpoing skill... set-jump timing, not being boost reliant... that all went out the window.

So i ask you, how are we suppost to play DB? Are we suppost to play it like posted above? A long, boring, drawn-out match that I know gives me no feeling of self-accomplishment using the easiest aspects of the game to stop and attack the other team, a stalemate if you will? Are we suppost to play spam ball, blasting the ball around with our oversized hammers, at the speed we drive our cars in a small enclosed cube map? Are we suppost to not defend and make the game have high scores and make it pointless to play competativly?

I don't know the answer, i dont hold the vision, but i do believe "the blind leading the blind" applies to he who does.

gnomeh · Post by **gnomeh** » 22-07-2003 05:30

I didn't read all this shit...
but if this is the way to beat 1.8, why does your clan suck so much and havn't ever beat us. Please stfu and go away.

Bodom · Post by **Bodom** » 22-07-2003 05:36

I'm confused...SoP tried this and lost 20-0...

The tactics you just describes are mostly the exact opposite of what V3 does, and yet we win every game we play. Explain that one, oh mighty surge.

Xelent · Post by **Xelent** » 22-07-2003 05:40

I think this is the first time I completely understand where the euros are coming from. Sounds like someone should take up programming and fix this game the way "it should be", because apparently it isnt good enough this way.

Post by **The_One** » 22-07-2003 05:42

pah, foolish mortals!
your puny brains can't hope to comprehend the wisdom of The Surge!
:cough:

Deacan Sharp · Post by **Deacan Sharp** » 22-07-2003 06:19

OR! HERO RUN!

f1end · Post by **f1end** » 22-07-2003 10:51

TBH...I actually agree with surge, at least in part...

My answer????

Get rid of Sprint, and replace it with dribbling!!!! Yes, thats right folks...go back to 1.4b's settings for speeding back up to 100% speed as soon as u get rid of the ball, so the ball carrier has a slim chance, instead of none, of getting past a defender with the ball...by bouncing the ball like a basket-ball...if the defender is any good, he won't get past anyway!

Fruitcake · Post by **Fruitcake** » 22-07-2003 11:03

BRING BACK TEH DRIBBLE!!!!!
tbh i don't believe Deathball separates the skill difference out much at all...EVERY decent player knows how to volly. I would like to see more skills implemented into this game to spread out the range of skills to separate the good the decent and the superior. One of these skills could perhaps be dribbling or the volly radius could be halved and the power back to what it was in 1.4b!

Fallen · Post by **Fallen** » 22-07-2003 13:58

Surge, I watched that whole game yesterday between SoP vs Rush Red. On defense, you could of used alot of help, whereas don't just sit back and let them get comfy and box you in like they did and pass the ball around. Atleast try to box them out further before resorting to pbox camping because you guys do not efficiently use it well. You played a good 10 mins in the game, then lost it because of bad passing and bad boosting.

XiLLeRaToR · Post by **XiLLeRaToR** » 22-07-2003 14:57

surge i know i prolly speak for a lot of the community when i say this, and i knew this maybe seems a little out of line, and if i dont care why would i post etc but....
FUCK OFF AND DIE U TWAT!

Onge · Post by **Onge** » 22-07-2003 15:13

FUCK OFF AND DIE U TWAT!

Elegantly and succinctly put XiLLeRaToR. Couldn't agree more.

gnomeh · Post by **gnomeh** » 22-07-2003 15:46

I concur with xillerator

GazMaN · Post by **GazMaN** » 22-07-2003 16:57

man , surge has got too much time on his hands, i got half way down the post b4 i fell asleep, 1 thing i dont understand, if its so easy to defend, use that method to stop ur unstoppable attacking technique! 0-0 draws all round

like i said i didnt read all the post so if u explain it more l8r, i cant b arsed!

why do u play db again surge? i forget

Inphidel · Post by **Inphidel** » 22-07-2003 17:05

I dunno about this surge. i've had alot more fun with deathball lately then ever before. I was more pissed off when dribbling was around, why?

because people hogged the ball, ego's we're born. the same thing came from volly. I still get pissed when people choose to volly it to themselves then pass to the open man.

I do think some things might want to be changed in deathball with the penalty zone. while turtling can be effective. i rarely see it happen. more often then not I see at most 2 other defenders with the goalie. good passing can defeat this and using other forwards as fodder to break the defensive zone.

and if this was all true that your speaking, games would result in 0 - 0 tie all the time... when in fact I see more scoring now then in 1.6.

My opinion is however from a public server standpoint, i'm not affiliated with any teams. but this mod has been really good fun for public games lately. I'm sure i've played with some of you guys on this same board and might agree. we've had some pretty damn good games out there.

You can look at it as boring game play or you can look at is as a tense battle between two teams. I'd take low scoring games anyday to 20-13 type scores. Leave dribbing to basket ball. we use guns in deathball.

Deathball only needs more creative maps that change gameplay. warped walls to make volly harder. smaller pentaltie zones and goals like ice deamon (which is in fact a great map - keepers really need to be on there toes)

blah blah blah..

fuck dribbling. it increases your chance of bugging anyway.

my own suggestions:

non goalie players in pentalie zone, volly radius reduced to prevent shielding the entire net.

players spawn close to the center along the walls instead of near the goal.

increase normal shot power a little to compete with volly.

reduce ammount of sprint (you can spring the lenght of cube practicly) but increase the recharge speed to allow many small springs then one long sprint to use to fake goalies and defenders.

note: I'm happy with deathball, i see no required changes... give me more maps!

TEZC_Robban · Post by **TEZC_Robban** » 22-07-2003 18:49

lol, surge didnt do anything wrong here, as i saw it he was bringing light onto what he thought was at fault with the deathball gameplay and directly 4-5 dudes flame him for no particular reason..

this community sucks