My little gameplay story and why DB is on the right way now.
Moderators: Jay2k1, DavidM, The_One
-
EsorcismoNJD
- Posts: 156
- Joined: 20-12-2004 20:18
This has to be the second sign of armaggedon... first, the Red Sox winning the World Series, now, me agreeing with Fornoth.
It's not like it matters for us anyway, if NA wants to stay 2.3 they can stay 2.3, no big deal. It'd be great to have a version we all like. 2.4 ain't bad, ain't great but ain't bad. It takes away some but gives back others. For instance, ".2" is finally fixed which was always a huge issue. However, breakaways are almost instant goals which to me is kinda pointless. Now, everyone knows me as the big hockey fan and that's one of the reasons I like hockey over soccer, the fact that a breakaway is a battle of wits. Giving the keeper little or no chance on a breakaway may lead to the attitude that is plaguing mixers, "well if I can't do anything about it, why bother?"
Being able to discuss some of these changes would probably get more people's attention as far as giving this a shot. Shooting down all of the people that are against it, probably not the best move for a game with a diminishing community. NA is planning on possibly trying out 2.4c after this current league is over in a testing mode, this will determine what gets used in the next season should there be a next season.
My biggest concern is this, 2.4 and it's subsequent patches have been out a while, correct? How many people have come as a result of this new version, I'm guessing not many. The NA community is split on the 2.3/2.4 issue, but they're all sticking around for 2.3. Force a change to 2.4, some may say screw it and leave. Granted, we have initiatives in place to get pubs brewing again to get new players into it; last Monday night was our first official pub-a-thon dedicated to trying to get new blood into the game. I know you're against pubs, but people won't just flock to IRC after installing a game, not happening. They see pubs, develop interest, and then seek to get further into it. Better get all the people you can get now, once UT2K7 comes out... the floodgates for newbies all but close.
Now, proceed with the flaming...
It's not like it matters for us anyway, if NA wants to stay 2.3 they can stay 2.3, no big deal. It'd be great to have a version we all like. 2.4 ain't bad, ain't great but ain't bad. It takes away some but gives back others. For instance, ".2" is finally fixed which was always a huge issue. However, breakaways are almost instant goals which to me is kinda pointless. Now, everyone knows me as the big hockey fan and that's one of the reasons I like hockey over soccer, the fact that a breakaway is a battle of wits. Giving the keeper little or no chance on a breakaway may lead to the attitude that is plaguing mixers, "well if I can't do anything about it, why bother?"
Being able to discuss some of these changes would probably get more people's attention as far as giving this a shot. Shooting down all of the people that are against it, probably not the best move for a game with a diminishing community. NA is planning on possibly trying out 2.4c after this current league is over in a testing mode, this will determine what gets used in the next season should there be a next season.
My biggest concern is this, 2.4 and it's subsequent patches have been out a while, correct? How many people have come as a result of this new version, I'm guessing not many. The NA community is split on the 2.3/2.4 issue, but they're all sticking around for 2.3. Force a change to 2.4, some may say screw it and leave. Granted, we have initiatives in place to get pubs brewing again to get new players into it; last Monday night was our first official pub-a-thon dedicated to trying to get new blood into the game. I know you're against pubs, but people won't just flock to IRC after installing a game, not happening. They see pubs, develop interest, and then seek to get further into it. Better get all the people you can get now, once UT2K7 comes out... the floodgates for newbies all but close.
Now, proceed with the flaming...
DavidM wrote: otherway around imo. messy explained it pretty well whats going wrong, so i'm not repeating him now.
Ha, ha, Messy had it all wrong, at least as far as the NA is concerned.
Esorcismo gave you a clue to why the NA went back to playing 2.3. "breakaways"
Never heard an NA keeper say anything but, that keeping was easier. The NA didn't find that the keeper was the dominant position, they found the "cherry picker" dominant. "Bomb ball" was much more effective due to the changes in 2.4. And of course, the less skilled the enviornment the greater it's effect.
Even with 2.3, people are looking at was to code out the long bomb. Goldeneye has coded an offsides mutator and a 3 line passing one for testing.
The game gets really boring if your stuck in the middle with nothing to do. Not too many people like it when the games turns into a bomb ball fest.
Go ahead, fire away. But its not a real solution if it won't work for pubs also.
Last edited by Twigstir on 07-06-2006 22:08, edited 1 time in total.
DavidM wrote: otherway around imo. messy explained it pretty well whats going wrong, so i'm not repeating him now.
We're not asking for a democracy. We're asking you to not blow us off because "we don't get it", or that we haven't played 2.4 enough. You have, on more then one occasion basically said the equivilant of "I know whats right so STFU". You said earlier how you were trying to make RMB more prevalant. Come over to NA, we hardly ever euro pass it.
Fornoth wrote: the equivilant of "I know whats right so STFU".
Twigstir wrote: Ha, ha, Messy had it all wrong, at least as far as the NA is concerned.
I agree with Forn
it's a sad thing people use that to shorten discussions a lot.I'd appreciate if you'd tell me more Twig.
Different from what you might think, I am interested and would like to know about the situation in NA DB a bit better, me only playing a single pickup there every half a month or so doesn't quite help that.
(bold for emphasis, not to underline some polemic nature or whatever..I don't see what that would be good for
)
Hmm... First, long time no see.
Second, I agree that the keeper is too important, so I was thinking of making defense more important. Like when you hit a player, the ball will fall out of the ball-carriers control and land around 2 metres behind him (easy for him to pick up again, but still possible for the defender to get it). I know it's not exactly like soccer, but there's not much a defender can do when the other team attack the ballcarrier, and even if he hits him, the attacker still has 1-2 seconds to pass it on. I think this would make it more of a team-play, as you have to pass it when a defender comes right against you, and not after he's already tackled.
I know this would be a huge change.. I might just say this because im a defender myself
Second, I agree that the keeper is too important, so I was thinking of making defense more important. Like when you hit a player, the ball will fall out of the ball-carriers control and land around 2 metres behind him (easy for him to pick up again, but still possible for the defender to get it). I know it's not exactly like soccer, but there's not much a defender can do when the other team attack the ballcarrier, and even if he hits him, the attacker still has 1-2 seconds to pass it on. I think this would make it more of a team-play, as you have to pass it when a defender comes right against you, and not after he's already tackled.
I know this would be a huge change.. I might just say this because im a defender myself
You want to make there be a little less needo n a GREAT keeper. look into the no 3line pass "offsides'
I will make a post later tonight when i get outa work I actually wrote up a big Q&A at what I hope to accomplish with such a rule
It would hardly slow down the game, and make one on one chances on the net a less frequent occourance, so when it happens you know its earned. or the other team REALLY messed up.
I beleive Deathball is a team sport of A keeper. and field players. not one person should be designated to prevent bombed passes.
anyway before i just explain here. I'll say this. wait till later on i'll post it on the forum later... I beleive it would improve DB ALOT for pubs and league play.
I will make a post later tonight when i get outa work I actually wrote up a big Q&A at what I hope to accomplish with such a rule
It would hardly slow down the game, and make one on one chances on the net a less frequent occourance, so when it happens you know its earned. or the other team REALLY messed up.
I beleive Deathball is a team sport of A keeper. and field players. not one person should be designated to prevent bombed passes.
anyway before i just explain here. I'll say this. wait till later on i'll post it on the forum later... I beleive it would improve DB ALOT for pubs and league play.
Keeper is very important atm, yes - he also gives alot(!!) chances for a good counter attack atm (2.4e)
Defending got really hard also (for all the 4fieldplayers) - for once because you can pass much faster to your offensive players (improved RMB)
its not much noobfriendly atm, unless its a 5on5 with new/low skilled players only
Defending got really hard also (for all the 4fieldplayers) - for once because you can pass much faster to your offensive players (improved RMB)
its not much noobfriendly atm, unless its a 5on5 with new/low skilled players only
db has no future with the current community situation.
i don't have the numbers.. but i'd be willing to bet the number of new players joining the community is less than the number of old players leaving the community (over time)
this has nothing to do with db.. but more to do with ut2k4.
this means, there is no future for db in the current setup.. regardless of versions.
therefore,
the answer is simple.. we need to free ourselves from ut2k4! and ut2k7 is not the answer either.. cuz that will only give us a few years and a few new players.
the more long term solution is standalone.
and the current NA community can remain as is playing ut2k4.. while the new standalone game opens up the horizons.
i don't have the numbers.. but i'd be willing to bet the number of new players joining the community is less than the number of old players leaving the community (over time)
this has nothing to do with db.. but more to do with ut2k4.
this means, there is no future for db in the current setup.. regardless of versions.
therefore,
the answer is simple.. we need to free ourselves from ut2k4! and ut2k7 is not the answer either.. cuz that will only give us a few years and a few new players.
the more long term solution is standalone.
and the current NA community can remain as is playing ut2k4.. while the new standalone game opens up the horizons.